First of all, I was raised in Norway - where you are raised to love America. I have always done that and guess I always will. I have visited the US numerous times and have some really good friends there. So it's not that I'm anti-America or anything...
TinyElvis wrote:
... It is the only democracy in the region and surrounded by countries that hate the people of Israel for their freedom, religion and 'western culture'. What is is the the Palestinians want? They want the complete anilhilation of Israel.
I'm not sure the Palestinians living in Israel feels the way you do about the democracy and freedom you talk about. As to what the Palestinians want? A piece of what was theirs in the first place, I should guess. Remember, the state of Israel was established in 1948 by the UN. Since then the Israelis (it would be more correct to say 'the jews' but that will only cause some of you to call me a nazi so I'll stick with 'the Israelis') has refused to live by any UN resolution regarding their occupation of more land and/or how they treat of the palestinians in the occupied regions. The UN gave them a finger and they took the whole hand.
TinyElvis wrote:
So, I ask again.. what is the is that Israel does to the innocent, peace-loving Palestinians and their icon-of-humanity leader Arafat?
I guess I have answered this above. I DO NOT DEFEND how the Palestinians act, but I must say that I can understand that they are pissed. And when your fine democracy sends their army to kill their political opponents (Ahmed Yassin) I feel there is something wrong.
Anyway, the bottom line is that religion sucks! Big time! So lets forget this shit and play some music instead. Or in my case, go to bed. I just realized it is 1:30 AM over here....
Hank Snow wrote:I guess they are doing the same thing to the Palestineans that the european and early americans did to the Indians on this continent. So if it is OK for us to have done it must be OK for them too.
Afterall, we are talking about Christians and Jews here, and Palestine is Muslim and the Indians were just heathen savages, not nearly as important. It must be "god's" will.
Sheesh.. you must not the know the answer either.
Ok. Get out a map of the middle east... look at the tiny little strip of land that is the country of Israel. It is the only democracy in the region and surrounded by countries that hate the people of Israel for their freedom, religion and 'western culture'. What is is the the Palestinians want? They want the complete anilhilation of Israel.
So, I ask again.. what is the is that Israel does to the innocent, peace-loving Palestinians and their icon-of-humanity leader Arafat?
I guess they are doing the same thing to the Palestineans that the european and early americans did to the Indians on this continent. So if it is OK for us to have done it must be OK for them too.
Afterall, we are talking about Christians and Jews here, and Palestine is Muslim and the Indians were just heathen savages, not nearly as important. It must be "god's" will.
Mort wrote:My guess is that the only way to win the war agains terrorism is for the US to stop supporting Israel. As long as the US turn their blind eye to what the Israelis do to the palestinians, the rest of the Islamic world will continue to hate the US.
M.
And what exactly is it the the Israelis *do* to the Palestinians?
My guess is that the only way to win the war agains terrorism is for the US to stop supporting Israel. As long as the US turn their blind eye to what the Israelis do to the palestinians, the rest of the Islamic world will continue to hate the US.
if there is another attack close to election time bush can declare martial law, from what i understand, and delay the election. it almost seems that they are working together, but we won't go there. can anyone say "new world order"?
Yeah I think the terrorists want Bush to win cause they know he won't come after them too hard. He will just go to Iraq instead and fight a war there that has nothing to do with our great country being attacked by Terrorists.
What about Iran? What about Saudi Arabia? What about North Korea? What about finishing things up over in Afghanistan. What about those damn Canadians?????
What the hell are we doing in Iraq? I just don't understand.
Did anyone see the headline on the Drudge Report that read Janet Jackson is now saying the Bush Administration used her Boob to turn attention away from the War in Iraq?
loosestring wrote:i'd say the terrorists want bush to win
I would definitely agree to that...he's done nothing but aid the cause of the terrorists his entire time in office. I fear that the terrorists will try and attack in the next few months to try and cause a massive rally around the president...THEY WANT BUSH IN OFFICE!
OK I just read too much into your responses, or else I was feeling inferior because of your powerful answers. Ha ha. I guess it was rude to throw you into the Rush Limbaugh pile without knowing for sure. I apologize.
Healthy debate is awesome and I enjoy it. I was raised in a family where it was actively performed on a daily basis. My dad was just like Archie Bunker and my Brother was just like Meathead, and it went from there.
Imagine, as all of us discuss these things and voice our opinions about one side or the other, imagine if we lived in a place where if I disagreed with George Bush or Tiny E, I was killed. Or vice versa. There are places like that on this earth and all of us are incredibly lucky to live in a place where FREEDOM is FIRST.
There are a lot of flaws in our country, a lot of things that need fixing, a lot of disagreement about how to fix it, but Damn we are still living in the greatest place on earth!!!
Hank Snow wrote:One thing, Tiny E, that you and Rush Limbaugh (who I enjoy listening to) need to realize is that just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they are idiots and doesn't mean they are wrong. Right is not always right, and life is not all Black and White.
Also, learn to laugh man, you seem really uptight about this politics thing.
I bet you didn't even think my supreme being poll was funny!!!!
Peace man, calm down.
I do not listen to Limbaugh often enough to know where he stands (not do I care). However, I DO know that I did not call you an idiot but simply disagreed and challenged your assertions. I thought you had said earlier that debate was healthy.. or is that only when a leftist is disagreeing with "right-wing" idealogy?
I'm very calm. You infer too much excitement in my responses.
man you are kind of high strung Tiny E. I thought I had too much coffee this am, but you, geeze. I respect that you are a hard core right winger, that is cool, that is what the USA is all about man, different ideas. Too bad you are wrong. Ha ha just kidding.
OK just for fun let me respond.
Yes, that is his business, not mine, but since he was discussing it on a message board and we were discussing politics, I thought I would address it. I think it was more his writing style that confused me.
It doesn't make me feel good to say anything about abortions. Abortions are not a good thing, it is not some wonderful thing i am cheering for. I can't even comprehend (and neither can any other MALE human) what it must be like to be faced with such a decision. Only women can get pregnant, only women have to carry the child for 9 months, only women have to use their body for that purpose, only women have to live with the consequences of aborting the fetus or raising a child, only women have to deal with it. Men do not. It is the woman's choice, it is her body, it is her life, it is her choice. I read the article you mentioned, and that is sad and horrible and disgusting. There is nothing about abortion that is nice and wonderful. But it doesn't change the fact that it is a woman's choice ONLY. I am not trying to impress any women or to feel good about it, it is the truth. It is a woman's choice and a woman's right as a free citizen to make that choice, and it must stay that way.
Bush lied, their was no immenent threat of Iraq attacking us. It is scary to think of what might of got moved to Syria or other places, but not nearly as scary as 1000 US soldiers dead for a lie. It was not the War on Terror they died for, they didn't die protecting america's freedom, they didn't die punishing the people who killed our citizens on 9/11. They shouldn't have died and we shouldn't be there.
No I did not support Clinton sending troops to Kosovo, because of the simple fact that it was not in the best interest of the US. If we stopped genocide from happening there then that was a good thing, but as I have said before, we didn't stop it in other places like Ruwanda. I think our soldiers and sailors and pilots and others need to be used to protect us and our freedom. The problem is not with the troops, it is with the Leaders who send them places, be it democrats or republicans.
I didn't say anything derogatory against the Guard, I said something about George W who took it easy during the Nam years. At least he did a little more than Bill Clinton.
I was being sarcastic about Kerry, to an extent. I think he is one of those people (like Bill Clinton) who from a very young age knew he was going to be running for high office. I don't think he wounded himself, but I do think he has lived a life calculating how each move would affect his future career.
But he isn't a right wing nut, so I am going to vote for him.
One thing, Tiny E, that you and Rush Limbaugh (who I enjoy listening to) need to realize is that just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they are idiots and doesn't mean they are wrong. Right is not always right, and life is not all Black and White.
Also, learn to laugh man, you seem really uptight about this politics thing.
I bet you didn't even think my supreme being poll was funny!!!!
Hank Snow wrote:dtgrock you make some valid points, but you confuse me in some of your statements. It doesn't seem real clear to me which side you are on.
Maybe that's his business and not yours?
Hank Snow wrote:I don't agree that only poor minorities get abortions. I don't think abortion is a political or moral issue whatsoever. It is a women's health issue plain and simple and that is all. I would vote for Kerry for that reason alone. It is a woman's body and it is her decision alone. End of discussion.
If might make you feel good to say that you don't agree, but that does not make it not true. I disagree that the sky is blue and the grass is green. Read this story and look at the face of the baby ripped out of this irresponsible woman and then tell us how you feel about it.
Hank Snow wrote:..Bush lied about it, people are dying. It sucks and it was a big mistake.
Bush lied, Clinton lied, the UN lied, Kerry lied.. man this was just one big conspiracy huh? The fact is, noone lied. There *were* weapons.. they were removed. Intelligence from EVERY country involved said there were weapons (including the UN). Everyone was wrong or everyone is a liar? Are you not the least bit curious in regards to the large quantities on chemical weapons confiscated in Syria a few months back?
Hank Snow wrote:Please don't misconstrue that to mean I don't support the troops, cause I do, they can't help where they are sent . They have to do their jobs, and follow orders. I support the troops 100% and want them to come home.
I assume you were against Clinton sending the troops to Kosovo as well? What is it that troops are supposed to do? Everytime they are deployed, you people start screaming to 'bring the troops home'.
Hank Snow wrote:Anyway, neither Bush nor Kerry have ever worked for anything. Kerry really did serve his country in a time of war, while Bush kicked back state side.
What an insult to anyone who serves in the National Guard. I guess you have more respect for Clinton who self-admittedly dodged the draft?
Hank Snow wrote:]However a lot of the time I think maybe Kerry spent his time in Vietnam trying to figure out how to use it to his advantage some day when he ran for president.
Yeah, like making up stories of his heroism, wounding himself, etc..
dtgrock you make some valid points, but you confuse me in some of your statements. It doesn't seem real clear to me which side you are on.
I don't agree that only poor minorities get abortions. I don't think abortion is a political or moral issue whatsoever. It is a women's health issue plain and simple and that is all. I would vote for Kerry for that reason alone. It is a woman's body and it is her decision alone. End of discussion.
Also, it seems as though you were saying Republicans are the only politicians with money. Hello, Kerry is married to a Billionaire. There are more democrat millionaires in congress that republican. They all have money and huge fund raising ability or they couldn't be playing at that level of politics.
I agree that bush is the lone ranger, and doesn't try to get a consensus. He had an agenda going in. he had planned to invade Iraq even before he was sworn in as president. I have discussed my views on that many times before. There are times for standing strong and standing on what you believe and then there are times when you need to get a consensus together.
However, people always say we went into Iraq with no support from any other country. I think it was wrong to go into Iraq, I think may people have died in vain there. But we did have support from England, Australia, Spain, and many others, so it is not like he went alone. But that being said, we shouldn't be in Iraq, it had nothing to do with 9/11 or WMD, Bush lied about it, people are dying. It sucks and it was a big mistake.
Please don't misconstrue that to mean I don't support the troops, cause I do, they can't help where they are sent . They have to do their jobs, and follow orders. I support the troops 100% and want them to come home.
Anyway, neither Bush nor Kerry have ever worked for anything. Kerry really did serve his country in a time of war, while Bush kicked back state side. However a lot of the time I think maybe Kerry spent his time in Vietnam trying to figure out how to use it to his advantage some day when he ran for president.
Anyway blah blah blah. This is getting too long. Kerry is the better choice, but he is not the Mr Perfect.